Oil recommendations.

[johndeeredr]

This is my first R1800B. Bought it used with 22.000 miles on it Other than OEM oils purchased at the dealership. What brand and weights do you all use ? I’m going to change the engine, transmission and final drive to start off fresh. Oil filter will be K&N . Always use them and liked there quantity.

 

[Star-Lord]

Hmmm... If only there was a search function on this forum... Oh wait..!!!

There's an entire library of folks discussing this topic... Me personally, Mobil 1 for the Engine oil and BMW stuff for the transmission and rear drive gear, at least until the warranty expires...

BMW Oil and Air filter, probably best to follow the weight specifications in the owners manual... Don't buy the cheap or poor quality stuff either

 

[Keehn]

OOOOH!!! I love oil threads!

FWIW, just make sure you use oil that meets/exceeds BMW's OEM standards. For me personally, I use "Liqui Moly Motorbike 4T SAE 15W-50", as it has all the standards required for our engines and catalytic converters, particularly "JASO MA2". Liquid Moly IMO is the best, cheapest oil for our bikes. I don't believe in throwing $$$$ towards brand names (e.g. BMW) when a cheaper brand has the EXACT SAME lubrication standards. It's like how the cheaper Walmart brand oil is just as good as the name brand stuff (in certain situations - watch "Project Farm" on YT, he tests these products).

All that tells me is that the "BMW's" of the world feel they can price gouge their customers.

Here's the oil I use:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00D91Q402/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_image?ie=UTF8&psc=1

And a quick article on the various JASO standards:
https://rymax-lubricants.com/updates/what-does-the-jaso-oil-specification-mean

Quick article on "API SL":
https://360.lubrizol.com/Specifications/API-Passenger/API-SL

Bottom line: "API SL" means it's top-shelf oil, and is the current API specification for modern engines. "JASO MA2" is the Japanese oil standard, with "MA2" signifying it's use in motorcycle engines that have catalytic converters.

Mike

 

[Keehn]

One more thing:

I have a passionate dislike for K&N air filters. Why?

Because people buy the initial product, do the initial oiling, then forget about it. They then do a crap job at cleaning/re-oiling (if at all) during filter "change".

K&N filters are great for racing applications because they are just a couple steps up from steel mesh filters, but for normal road usage, they let a LOT of micron particulates through. Additionally, there's a potential that the oil from the filter can collect on MAFs and burn out the heater element, thus ruining it.

If you're so inclined, here's some other people discussing K&N filters:
https://www.advrider.com/f/threads/why-is-k-n-air-filter-so-bad.409192/

Mike

 

[Ulrich]

Woohoo a oil thread ... I am with the previous posters on the fact that oil that meets the specs is just that. Any oil that meets specs is the right one, the rest is personal preference ... For me it is Bel-Ray 15/50 'Thumper'
I check the magnet on the drain plug very thoroughly on every oil change and so far it has been spotless clean every time.

 

[BER18 100]

When I scan the engine oil shelves at Walmart, I see every weight of Mobil1, Castrol, Valvoline, Pensoil, Havoline, Quaker State, and Super Tech.

Are any of these considered sub standard?

When I read that users need to use an oil that meets a certain standard, I find myself questioning what this means? Good grief, every brand listed above works.

My wife's Subaru uses 0W-20. My R18 uses 15W-50. One is water, one is thick. I'm beginning to think that whatever you put in your crankcase, if it is slippery, it works.

 

[Pork Rind]

Mobil 1 V twin 20w-50 . Fine if you aren't living in Canada, great for aircooled motorcycle engines. Having a dry clutch on the R-18, you don't really need the JASO MA2 rating.

Available at most Walmarts.

If you really want to run a true group IV and group V German synthetic oil, Liqui Moly or Motul should have what you need. Look for motorcycle ratings and labels on the bottles.

 

[kate_brett]

Motorex - has to be good cause the sticker says for Boxer motors. Who says advertising doesn’t influence one’s decision. Or was it because it was on sale ? Probably the latter.

 

[Keehn]

Mobil 1 V twin 20w-50 . Fine if you aren't living in Canada, great for aircooled motorcycle engines. Having a dry clutch on the R-18, you don't really need the JASO MA2 rating.

Available at most Walmarts.

If you really want to run a true group IV and group V German synthetic oil, Liqui Moly or Motul should have what you need. Look for motorcycle ratings and labels on the bottles.

Not correct. The JASO MA2 rating is specifically for motorcycles with catalytic converters, which our R18's have.

I linked to an article in my first post here that discusses the different JASO standards.

Mike

 

[Noelpolar]

Not correct. The JASO MA2 rating is specifically for motorcycles with catalytic converters, which our R18's have.

I linked to an article in my first post here that discusses the different JASO standards.

Mike

I must admit I still can't see the need for MA2 oils based on some technical reason.... I've read everything and must be missing something..... if a modern high quality synthetic SL to SN or better oil that is ok for vehicles with a Cat (they all are anyhow nowdays) then what does Jaso MA2 bring to the party in a R18 motor (or R Ninet)?...

 

[Keehn]

I must admit I still can't see the need for MA2 oils based on some technical reason.... I've read everything and must be missing something..... if a modern high quality synthetic SL to SN or better oil that is ok for vehicles with a Cat (they all are anyhow nowdays) then what does Jaso MA2 bring to the party in a R18 motor (or R Ninet)?...

I'm going with what BMW recommends:


https://www.bobsmotorcycles.com/product/bmw-advantec-pro-15w-50-engine-oil-one-liter/

BMW recommends the Advantec Pro, SAE 15w-50 (API SJ/JASO MA2) for our bikes (other models).

The API SJ standard is actually LOWER than the SL standard that Liquid Moly uses:


https://360.lubrizol.com/Specifications/API-Passenger/API-SL

And, of course, the JASO MA2 standard is also called for in the BMW Advantec Pro. Again, I refer to the JASO MA2 standard itself to clarify "why this and not that":


https://rymax-lubricants.com/updates/what-does-the-jaso-oil-specification-mean

The bottom line is that "JASO MA2" is a specification for catalytic converter-equipped motorcycles (which is ours).

Mike

 

[BER18 100]

Is the catalytic converter in the header pipe or in the muffler? I'm thinking of switching to the Hattech pipes from Hornig. I doubt there is a cat in that muffler.
If the cat is in the muffler then this oil question of JASO MA2 is a moot point for those who switch mufflers..

 

[Anibal]

https://www.r18forums.com/threads/catalytic-converter.455/

 

[Noelpolar]

I'm still none the wiser about why jaso is relevant from a technical perspective for our bikes.... such is life.

 

[Keehn]

I'm still none the wiser about why jaso is relevant from a technical perspective for our bikes.... such is life.

Okay, I'll break it down Barney-style:

Fact: Our bikes HAVE catalytic converters.

Fact: JASO MA2 is SPECIFICALLY formulated for motorcycles WITH catalytic converters.

Is your R18 still under warranty? If not, then get whatever the hell oil you want.

If you want BMW to honor your warranty, because you used oil that meets/exceeds their specification (API SJ/JASO MA2), then use oil that meets/exceeds those standards. Under the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act, a dealer can DENY coverage if its found you did NOT use fluids that at LEAST meets their specifications.

No degree in rocket science required here.

Mike

 

[BER18 100]

The catalytic converter on the R1200C was located in the extra wide crossover.
Is it physically possible to place a cat in the header pipes of an R18?
The header pipe diameter isn’t even 1.5 inches, is it?

 

[Keehn]

The catalytic converter on the R1200C was located in the extra wide crossover.
Is it physically possible to place a cat in the header pipes of an R18?
The header pipe diameter isn’t even 1.5 inches, is it?

Anibal linked to the catalytic converter thread elsewhere on this site.

Refer to post #3 for a microfiche of the cat in question.

But, to quickly answer your question, yes, it is possible, and BMW did it.

Mike

 

[Noelpolar]

Okay, I'll break it down Barney-style:

Fact: Our bikes HAVE catalytic converters.

Fact: JASO MA2 is SPECIFICALLY formulated for motorcycles WITH catalytic converters.

Is your R18 still under warranty? If not, then get whatever the hell oil you want.

If you want BMW to honor your warranty, because you used oil that meets/exceeds their specification (API SJ/JASO MA2), then use oil that meets/exceeds those standards. Under the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act, a dealer can DENY coverage if its found you did NOT use fluids that at LEAST meets their specifications.

No degree in rocket science required here.

Mike

I think we are talking different things.

I want to know what does the MA2 "tick" bring to the "characteristics/properties" of a modern oil, that would otherwise meet the required oil API "tick" (and are relevant to motorcycle engine that does not have a wet clutch or shared gearbox).

I think its not related to the cat (as API oils are compatable with cats, nothing special here).... I understand the additive package etc will be different because of wet clutch and gearbox requirements (that are not relevant to our bikes)....

So.... my mind goes to "why is the BMW oil spec for this bike include a JASO MA2"?

I know lots of "air head" owners have used non Jaso MA oils in the past without issues. I've found nothing related to engine heat, load, temperature, metalurgy etc that explains this.

The other mind bogling thing is how basic/old is a API SJ rating......

I'm not asking what oil to use in my bike, I am trying to understand the relevance of the Jaso rating as it stands in a modern boxer without a wet clutch/gerabox.... and "because BMW said so" is not an answer to this.

Though, I do appreciate the effort you went to regarding yoir post.... thankyou.

 

[Cornel]

I think we are talking different things.

I want to know what does the MA2 "tick" bring to the "characteristics/properties" of a modern oil, that would otherwise meet the required oil API "tick" (and are relevant to motorcycle engine that does not have a wet clutch or shared gearbox).

I think its not related to the cat (as API oils are compatable with cats, nothing special here).... I understand the additive package etc will be different because of wet clutch and gearbox requirements (that are not relevant to our bikes)....

So.... my mind goes to "why is the BMW oil spec for this bike include a JASO MA2"?

I know lots of "air head" owners have used non Jaso MA oils in the past without issues. I've found nothing related to engine heat, load, temperature, metalurgy etc that explains this.

The other mind bogling thing is how basic/old is a API SJ rating......

I'm not asking what oil to use in my bike, I am trying to understand the relevance of the Jaso rating as it stands in a modern boxer without a wet clutch/gerabox.... and "because BMW said so" is not an answer to this.

Though, I do appreciate the effort you went to regarding yoir post.... thankyou.

I was wondering the exact same issue and this is my conclusion: BMW recommends their recommended oil for multiple models, not just the R18s and other bike models have wet clutches. That is the reason they recommend the JASO MA2, because their oil meets that specification also. Like you said, there are plenty of oils that are catalytic converter friendly and do not have the JASO MA2 rating.

 

[Noelpolar]

I was wondering the exact same issue and this is my conclusion: BMW recommends their recommended oil for multiple models, not just the R18s and other bike models have wet clutches. That is the reason they recommend the JASO MA2, because their oil meets that specification also. Like you said, there are plenty of oils that are catalytic converter friendly and do not have the JASO MA2 rating.

Given the lack of facts around this, this is my thoughts as well at this time, as an ex corporate profit driven manager of a manufacturing type business.

Some businesses might see an opportunity to create several product lines with increased profits for higher end options, however I could see BMW taking this concept one step further..... "one product, just good enough to get by, but priced as a premium product".... lot's of down stream cost benefit to them here lifting overall profit margins. I'd guess thier 70-80 diff oil thing is a similar profit driven initiative (make the spec just unique enough so most people won't bother to question).

I will add, back in the dark ages, I think the Jaso standard may possibly have had other less known benefits over most automotive oils at the time (heat, revs, oil life).... however the development of modern oils since has probally negated this (except for the clutch/gearbox thing off course).